Great - I appreciate your skilled weighing of every part of a situation presented in straight forward, easy to process chunks. Who knew the development of social media would allow us to have incisive legal minds mixing and mingling with the screaming hordes. Thank you for the time and effort this and other pieces take.
Endorse Sande's assessment and add that Mr Fisher also demonstrates partisanship in loyally accepting the preferred pronouns of Mr Doyle, and using them throughout the article. He also described Ani O’Brien, as "a prominent voice in the lesbian community who is seeking to differentiate biological women from transgender women." Easily overlooked both appear to me to place Mr Fisher in the "gender trumps sex in public life" camp.
Thanks for your comment and your remarks. If I had covered every one of Fisher's issues the post would have been much longer than it was and I did contemplate reproducing the article and dissecting it paragraph by paragraph. I opted for a commentary instead.
Fisher does have a tendency to make side comments as he did with Ani O'Brien.
You will note that I did not follow Fisher into the "pronoun" trap which may be classified as disrespectful but I have more respect for facts.
Thanks I noticed that. A thorugh analysis can be so helpful in understanding where the power lies. Few journos / writers in NZ have critically touched the gender medicine issue that Doyle is so keen on. Outright misrepresentations in his maiden speech and at the demonstration the other week go uncommented on.
Good piece, David. I would add that my analysis of the blue spiral emoji never touched on arm tattoos, so David Fisher was accidentally interviewing his keyboard by that stage. The "blue spiral emoji" is not a Māori cultural expression and taonga... it's a symbol that triggers an Instagram search warning about accessing child sexual abuse content.
Nor was the Herald apologia correct about Doyle's Instagram account being private. It was, until last week, publicly accessible. Again, far too much reliance on misinformation in that Herald "investigation".
Thanks Ian. And thanks for the additional info on the blue spiral.
My concern is that Fisher and Audrey Young, both of whom have covered this story, have slanted it in such a way that it does nothing to enhance public confidence in Mainstream Media. Therein lies the tragedy.
It was undisclosed by the Herald and David Fisher that his son is trans and transitioning to be a girl. There is a NZ Herald article from last year that featured Fisher junior and his attempted hunger strike
The Goodsir/Fisher/Swarbrick argument that the language used can only be understood through a ‘rainbow’ (ie weirdo) paradigm, is as specious & lame as Mahuta’s defence of 3 Waters, namely that we simply did not understand well enough to judge. Or that they use provocative language within their own circles, but that’s somehow ok?(…just like tikanga huh??).
Well, yeah… nah. Would she extend the same argument to a white skinhead chap referring to someone as a n**ger?
Good write up thanks, among many I’ve read on this. This dude is clearly a creep and a loopy one at that. His history is certainly more relevant than young Uffindell bullying another kid in their dorm room…
Fancy...a politician seeking to gain political advantage.
Folk will likely look for the 'flavour' of this matter & most won't be that interested in the finer points...where there's smoke etc, the big picture seems to show to poor taste/judgement, perhaps worse, it's yet another Greens party fuss...y.
I could see this may be a time to fence-sit until things became clearer, whilst enjoying the schadenfreude. Bigly. May it last long.
The "these were from a private account" never stopped the media before. The blatant bias is morally disgusting. I wonder if think grooming gangs are conspiracy theories too.
I read your article and noted, amongst other things, your critique of the misuse of language. In the same vein I make the following observations.
You use the term scatological to describe what appear to be Doyle’s pre-occupations. Some dictionaries ascribe two meanings to the word, but most only give one. The primary meaning is an interest in faeces. The secondary meaning relates to obscenity, a loaded term at the best of times. Doyle’s use of the neologism “bussy” (a word I had never heard of before Tuesday) is not indicative of an interest in solid excreta anymore than an interest in a vulva is indicative of an interest in urine. As for the significance of the blue squiggle, I’m unsure. I am not convinced by the claim that it has cultural significance. But is it really obscene?
You then suggest that a person named Goodsir misuses the word “stochastic” when it is used as a qualifier of the word “terrorism”. To a statistician the word has a clear meaning as you say. However, there is no doubt the word has been enlisted to describe a social or political meaning which entails a semantic shift. Britannica gives this definition:
stochastic terrorism, the repeated use of hate speech or other vilifying, dehumanizing rhetoric by a political leader or other public figure that inspires one or more of the figure’s supporters to commit hate crimes …
I assume the word has been used because of its association with randomness. Unfortunate that may be but then if I am bewildered by a storm in a teacup it does not mean that I am lost in pathless places or confounded for want of a plain road. Mr Goodsir’s use is accurate given the death threats that apparently ensued.
Finally, you describe Mr Goodsir as offering a neo-Marxist justification. To claim that is to fail to understand Marx. His commentary is an economic theory and I see no economics within what you report of Mr Goodsir’s comments. The expression neo-Marxism or cultural Marxism is a used as a term of abuse meant to invoke Stalin or Mao. And quite why Mr Goodsir is self-styled as himself is anyone’s guess.
Great - I appreciate your skilled weighing of every part of a situation presented in straight forward, easy to process chunks. Who knew the development of social media would allow us to have incisive legal minds mixing and mingling with the screaming hordes. Thank you for the time and effort this and other pieces take.
Thanks for your comment and encouragement. Much appreciated.
The one person who could clarify all this remains mysteriously silent!
One wonders if Mr Fisher has ever heard the phrase ‘ if you’re explaining you’re losing’?
Endorse Sande's assessment and add that Mr Fisher also demonstrates partisanship in loyally accepting the preferred pronouns of Mr Doyle, and using them throughout the article. He also described Ani O’Brien, as "a prominent voice in the lesbian community who is seeking to differentiate biological women from transgender women." Easily overlooked both appear to me to place Mr Fisher in the "gender trumps sex in public life" camp.
Thanks for your comment and your remarks. If I had covered every one of Fisher's issues the post would have been much longer than it was and I did contemplate reproducing the article and dissecting it paragraph by paragraph. I opted for a commentary instead.
Fisher does have a tendency to make side comments as he did with Ani O'Brien.
You will note that I did not follow Fisher into the "pronoun" trap which may be classified as disrespectful but I have more respect for facts.
Thanks I noticed that. A thorugh analysis can be so helpful in understanding where the power lies. Few journos / writers in NZ have critically touched the gender medicine issue that Doyle is so keen on. Outright misrepresentations in his maiden speech and at the demonstration the other week go uncommented on.
Good piece, David. I would add that my analysis of the blue spiral emoji never touched on arm tattoos, so David Fisher was accidentally interviewing his keyboard by that stage. The "blue spiral emoji" is not a Māori cultural expression and taonga... it's a symbol that triggers an Instagram search warning about accessing child sexual abuse content.
Nor was the Herald apologia correct about Doyle's Instagram account being private. It was, until last week, publicly accessible. Again, far too much reliance on misinformation in that Herald "investigation".
What I actually said, is here:
https://centrist.nz/open-letter-to-nz-media-on-green-mp-benjamin-doyle/
Thanks Ian. And thanks for the additional info on the blue spiral.
My concern is that Fisher and Audrey Young, both of whom have covered this story, have slanted it in such a way that it does nothing to enhance public confidence in Mainstream Media. Therein lies the tragedy.
It was undisclosed by the Herald and David Fisher that his son is trans and transitioning to be a girl. There is a NZ Herald article from last year that featured Fisher junior and his attempted hunger strike
This sort of conflict of interest should be declared at the beginning of the article as it is clear the author will not be unbiased.
The Goodsir/Fisher/Swarbrick argument that the language used can only be understood through a ‘rainbow’ (ie weirdo) paradigm, is as specious & lame as Mahuta’s defence of 3 Waters, namely that we simply did not understand well enough to judge. Or that they use provocative language within their own circles, but that’s somehow ok?(…just like tikanga huh??).
Well, yeah… nah. Would she extend the same argument to a white skinhead chap referring to someone as a n**ger?
Good write up thanks, among many I’ve read on this. This dude is clearly a creep and a loopy one at that. His history is certainly more relevant than young Uffindell bullying another kid in their dorm room…
Re Uffindell - I was at Kings College in the early 1960's. I shall say no more.
Thanks David.
Fancy...a politician seeking to gain political advantage.
Folk will likely look for the 'flavour' of this matter & most won't be that interested in the finer points...where there's smoke etc, the big picture seems to show to poor taste/judgement, perhaps worse, it's yet another Greens party fuss...y.
I could see this may be a time to fence-sit until things became clearer, whilst enjoying the schadenfreude. Bigly. May it last long.
Why is Mr Doyle described as being part of the rainbow community? He appears to have a wife and child.
I add my thanks for your incisive analysis and heartily approve/endorse your final paragraph, David
The "these were from a private account" never stopped the media before. The blatant bias is morally disgusting. I wonder if think grooming gangs are conspiracy theories too.
Fisher will look mighty silly - if not much worse - if it transpires that Benjamin Bussy really does harbour unnatural interests in children
I read your article and noted, amongst other things, your critique of the misuse of language. In the same vein I make the following observations.
You use the term scatological to describe what appear to be Doyle’s pre-occupations. Some dictionaries ascribe two meanings to the word, but most only give one. The primary meaning is an interest in faeces. The secondary meaning relates to obscenity, a loaded term at the best of times. Doyle’s use of the neologism “bussy” (a word I had never heard of before Tuesday) is not indicative of an interest in solid excreta anymore than an interest in a vulva is indicative of an interest in urine. As for the significance of the blue squiggle, I’m unsure. I am not convinced by the claim that it has cultural significance. But is it really obscene?
You then suggest that a person named Goodsir misuses the word “stochastic” when it is used as a qualifier of the word “terrorism”. To a statistician the word has a clear meaning as you say. However, there is no doubt the word has been enlisted to describe a social or political meaning which entails a semantic shift. Britannica gives this definition:
stochastic terrorism, the repeated use of hate speech or other vilifying, dehumanizing rhetoric by a political leader or other public figure that inspires one or more of the figure’s supporters to commit hate crimes …
I assume the word has been used because of its association with randomness. Unfortunate that may be but then if I am bewildered by a storm in a teacup it does not mean that I am lost in pathless places or confounded for want of a plain road. Mr Goodsir’s use is accurate given the death threats that apparently ensued.
Finally, you describe Mr Goodsir as offering a neo-Marxist justification. To claim that is to fail to understand Marx. His commentary is an economic theory and I see no economics within what you report of Mr Goodsir’s comments. The expression neo-Marxism or cultural Marxism is a used as a term of abuse meant to invoke Stalin or Mao. And quite why Mr Goodsir is self-styled as himself is anyone’s guess.